Modern Sporting Rifle Evolution
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MDWS

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Experienced folks please let me know if you have done either, or both, and what you thought if it.

Thanks!



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wikster1983

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Reply with quote  #2 
I have done regular paintball for a few bachelor parties. Fun, but hurts like hell if you don't follow the 10ft call rule! What are you looking to find out?
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MDWS

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Quote:
Originally Posted by wikster1983
I have done regular paintball for a few bachelor parties. Fun, but hurts like hell if you don't follow the 10ft call rule! What are you looking to find out?


How realistic is it?  I get it, it's paintballs, space-looking guns and such, but what's the range like?  I see the balls are going around 280fps, it appears the standard size is .68 caliber, and they weigh around 3 grams.  That's a horrible BC and I wonder if they are really accurate in any way out to 50 yards or is it all spray and pray?

I'm also looking at Simunition and it says range for pistols is 25 feet and the M4 carbine 100 feet.  That sucks, too.

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wikster1983

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Reply with quote  #4 
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Originally Posted by MDWS


How realistic is it?  I get it, it's paintballs, space-looking guns and such, but what's the range like?  I see the balls are going around 280fps, it appears the standard size is .68 caliber, and they weigh around 3 grams.  That's a horrible BC and I wonder if they are really accurate in any way out to 50 yards or is it all spray and pray?

I'm also looking at Simunition and it says range for pistols is 25 feet and the M4 carbine 100 feet.  That sucks, too.

It varies, I used "house" markers, if you buy your own and pay for good stuff, they can be more accurate. There is a guy on youtube, something sniper, was making shots past 70-80 yards with his in combat re-enactment games. What I used I could head headshots near 30-40 yards, but was pretty much spray and pray. Accuracy maybe could have been better, but adult juice boxes before playing games make the sights jump around a bit- lol

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Dvalin

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I played woodsball (think wargame, not arena) for many years. It's a blast.

 Accuracy depends mostly on quality balls that are as round as possible with no noticable seams. With a decent gun and quality balls you can realistically expect 25-30 yd headshots and 50-60 yard body shots. I've pulled off longer shots but it's mosty luck and a target not paying attention.

I quit playing on public fields after the full autos were perfected, because it turned into a bunch of spray and pray, my gun shoots faster than yours and no tactics. If you can find group that likes to play with some planning and tactics, and not just who can spray the most paint it's awesome!

 If you're interested, I still have several guns and gear I'd make you a great deal on. 

Any other questions?
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MDWS

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Originally Posted by Dvalin
I played woodsball (think wargame, not arena) for many years. It's a blast.

 Accuracy depends mostly on quality balls that are as round as possible with no noticable seams. With a decent gun and quality balls you can realistically expect 25-30 yd headshots and 50-60 yard body shots. I've pulled off longer shots but it's mosty luck and a target not paying attention.

I quit playing on public fields after the full autos were perfected, because it turned into a bunch of spray and pray, my gun shoots faster than yours and no tactics. If you can find group that likes to play with some planning and tactics, and not just who can spray the most paint it's awesome!

 If you're interested, I still have several guns and gear I'd make you a great deal on. 

Any other questions?


I'm more interested in the woods version and perhaps small town stuff, but no inflatable arena stuff for me.  I'll do it a couple times to reaffirm I hate it.

Ok, let me know what you got.  I need to learn more about it.  I'm thinking of opening a place with Simunition CQB shoot-house and woods/small town paintball and Simunition.

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Thorman

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Reply with quote  #7 
Mark, I am a big paintballer here in IL and have sold defense/law enforcement equipment for years as well. Big difference between paintball and full blown Simunitions training. Real Simunitions style training is done shooting simulated rounds through real firearms with special barrels, etc. and specialized clothing/masks. Paintball is just that, shooting .68 caliber. Now, you can get very realistic type weapons to shoot paintballs and there are markers (guns) that are now mag fed. That is a big growth area in the sport in fact. These are big for scenario games where spray and pray is frowned upon. More tactics, more comms, really a lot of fun. You can do both woods or CQB type in structures.
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crazysccrmd

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I don't know if simunitions would be a good idea for a public game setting. They will easily break skin, leave some nasty welts and put an eye out if the player wears a poorly fitting mask or removes it during play. Sounds like a whole lot of liability for a business to take on. They are very good training tools though, using your real weapon that functions as it should with real pain as the consequence for screwing up.
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toagnt

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Never been paintballing but have done quite a bit of simunition training.  It works great close quarters indoors.  A few drawbacks..... range sucks, you need whole head protection (simunitions can take out an eye), ammo is expensive, can break skin (hurts but not unbearable and might be a plus for realistic training I've seen guys drop the guns after taking a gun hand hit), the guns end up jamming from the wax after not a lot of rounds, accuracy a little off with wax projectiles, comm and your overall hearing goes down if wearing helmets,...... but over all a good training.
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Omega

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Simunition mostly here, yes they hurt like hell even with protection.  The good thing is that for room clearing there is no question if you are hit or not, and when hit it makes you react to it which makes a difference in the outcome of the training scenario.  I've played both the OPFOR and hostage and have been hit in both roles, it's not fun. There is a range of ammo choices out there and some are better than others but tech has much improved so your weapon will act like your weapon. I think the key to any training scenario is taking it seriously, analyzing your mistakes and working to eliminate them.  As for my paintball experience, it was mostly a shoot-em up game, I think everyone was hit on both sides but it was a lot of fun, we used it as a PT session.
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MDWS

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Reply with quote  #11 
I appreciate the feedback from all... I will keep researching it.  I think a shoot house that uses Simunition and Paintball would be fun.



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kf4zht

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Reply with quote  #12 
I was into paintball on and off for many years. Finally sold my stuff, got to where playing would have me hobbling around for a week after and all my friends were dropping out. Most of the paintball is speedball and some woodsball. Most courses just turn into speedball in the woods, your average player just wants to get the gun that unloads 15+bps and just throw paint at anything that moves. Paint is cheap, I've seen guys run through 2-4 cases a day (2000 per case). 

Now there is a movement toward milsig or magfed paintball. I got into this for a while. instead of a hopper you have a magazine. This limits how many rounds you can shoot, forces a real reload action and lets you run optics that would normally just be blocked. Also they have First Strike (FS) paintballs. They are basically half a paintball with the back half being crude fins. Accurate out to much larger ranges (still not sniper type), more expensive but you should need less. You can get in pretty cheap, i had a Tipx pistol, which can be converted to FS and Hammer 7 which is FS ready out of the box. Tiberius arms makes higher end FS markers, as do a few other companies. 

I played airsoft way back in the day, before there were real fields. Much cooler on the milsim front, realistic ammo capacities, decent accuracy, real look and feel. Does require people to be honest about hits. 

There was a bada$$ field around here that was an old hotel, all CQB type stuff, the rooms still had door on them and long corridors you could get caught in. Completely different feel. They closed, not sure why. Typically insurance and bad management are the enemies of paintball fields. Tons of them are started by player who know nothing about how to run a company and staffed with the local kids who hung around too much anyway. While you can make good money if your ref's suck or you give bad CS its pretty easy to lose the regulars and you go down the toilet pretty quick. There is a decent market in batchelor parties, birthdays, etc but that take advertising. Also helps if your rental guns don't suck. From what i've heard you should have a jar of Vaseline ready for when you get the insurance quote.

What I would love to see is a field around that is focused on milsim. Use simunitions for the pistols, magfed paintball or airsoft for the carbines and airsoft for the snipers. Build scenarios around hostage rescue, VIP protection, etc. Require camo/military style clothing, realistic ammo capacities, holsters, slings, radio comms, etc. Target a more mature, tactical focused crowd. Don't kick the kids out, but don't allow in the ones that just want to play speedball. Teach classes with it even. Train refs to play along (aka don't stand next to someone hiding to see if they get hit)

It would take getting a dedicated crowd, but with the popularity of that market right now it could work quite well. Just needs the right advertising and good reviews. 
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halodub

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Reply with quote  #13 
There used to be a place here in WI that would do like giant 200-300 people tournaments, but I think they closed down a year or two ago. Apparently, there's another place (http://www.giantgame.com/) that does a 600 person tournament and is doing it in late August. Appears to have a pretty decent sized field for that amount of players. Might be something cool to check out if you're trying to get a feel for it.

I never got super into paintball as I used my dad's old equipment, but he had a few grand into his stuff and his marker used nitrogen as opposed to CO2, so it was kind of expensive to run. I recall getting a few good shots at about 50 yards if I really tried to poke someone, but the places I played at were a majority of spray and pray players. The cool thing with paintball is you can see the general arc of the ball when it shoots, so after a game or two you get a feel for how the marker shoots once you get it dialed in to your desired FPS range.
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MDWS

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Reply with quote  #14 
Thanks for the feedback guys.  I haven't done anything with this yet, but am seriously considering it!



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Livn358YETI

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Reply with quote  #15 
Hey Mark, Theres a place in Bristol WI (close to the WI IL border) that does wargames with airsoft. Probably a little less painful with more realistic guns. I've been meaning to make it down there. I have a buddy that is a regular that could show us the ropes if you and JR wanted to come up. Maybe get Sconsin and Hoyt out too for an afternoon. Check it out: http://www.blackops-airsoft.com/
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